Valve letting users sell Steam Workshop content...NOOOOT!!

#21

Valve’s stock on the MidTrang market is fucking plummeting lately.

#22

I wonder how Gaben feels about stuff like this. It feels so diametrically opposed to what he says.

#23

The buck stops with Bethesda, this is their IP so they should shoulder most of the blame here.

IMO the only thing Valve is guilty of is how they handled the legal side of things. With so many mods depending on each other this was bound to be a legal minefield. It was very stupid for Valve and Bethesda to not see what they were getting into. No sane person is going to sit on the sidelines and watch somebody else make money that was also dependent on their own work, by rights you would want your own cut.

I think its fair that Valve gets something from the sale of content. They support all the infrastructure to deliver the said content to the masses and all this stuff needs to be paid for somehow. They provide a service for a price and if the other parties involved don’t like the terms then they should take their business else where. Valve isn’t the only way to get these things done.

The other parties involved are of course Bethesda and the lowly mod creator. In this situation Bethesda holds all the cards. They own the IP so they alone can define the terms and conditions and other legal jargon on how mods are use in their games. They alone choose Steam Workshop to help deliver fan created content to Skyrim. It was their decision to monetize what was just a value added feature that they saw no direct profit from.They didn’t need Valve to help do this but obviously they felt it would be easier to partner with them to achieve their goals with their own IP. The mod creator can only sit along for the ride unfortunately.

If Bethesda wants to dictate in future that all mods can only go through steam workshop then that decision is all on them. If they want to create an environment where mods are monetized so you pay 99 cents for a shitty skin then that’s on them. They could have built their own infrastructure but decided to relied on a third party which in this case is Valve. Valve would have given them the terms of service for them to accept which looks to be inline with every other deal they do (30 - 25% cut and the other parties get the rest). I don’t exactly see why Bethesda deserve 50%, they aren’t doing anything to earn it other than owning the IP to dictate the terms of service. Or they could have done none of this and keep the current status quo as is.

I think this is a sign of things to come for Fallout 4/ TES VI. If this was the direction they wanted to go with then starting with a fresh slate would have removed all this convoluted dependencies problem they are currently in. I think Bethesda really screwed up by shoehorning this into their current title.

#24

Hear from the man himself.

Even before seeing this, I feel people are blowing it out of proportion. People can now sell mods officially where as before there was no official way to do so. If you’re upset a mod maker is charging it is their choice and not Valve or even the game maker’s fault.

The pricing issue is something else and I agree 50% to the game maker is too much. Don’t think that is Valve’s fault though. Giving mod makers a chance to make money is nice and adds more avenues for creators to create more and earn from it.

#25

Whelp, if you need me I’ll be digging through this for the next century

#26

#27

Removing Payment Feature From Skyrim Workshop

We’re going to remove the payment feature from the Skyrim workshop. For anyone who spent money on a mod, we’ll be refunding you the complete amount. We talked to the team at Bethesda and they agree.

We’ve done this because it’s clear we didn’t understand exactly what we were doing. We’ve been shipping many features over the years aimed at allowing community creators to receive a share of the rewards, and in the past, they’ve been received well. It’s obvious now that this case is different.

To help you understand why we thought this was a good idea, our main goals were to allow mod makers the opportunity to work on their mods full time if they wanted to, and to encourage developers to provide better support to their mod communities. We thought this would result in better mods for everyone, both free & paid. We wanted more great mods becoming great products, like Dota, Counter-strike, DayZ, and Killing Floor, and we wanted that to happen organically for any mod maker who wanted to take a shot at it.

But we underestimated the differences between our previously successful revenue sharing models, and the addition of paid mods to Skyrim’s workshop. We understand our own game’s communities pretty well, but stepping into an established, years old modding community in Skyrim was probably not the right place to start iterating. We think this made us miss the mark pretty badly, even though we believe there’s a useful feature somewhere here.

Now that you’ve backed a dump truck of feedback onto our inboxes, we’ll be chewing through that, but if you have any further thoughts let us know.

#28

Oh wow.

I kinda feel bad now.

#29

I’m sad for what could have been, but happy for what could still be. I think this will still start a conversation about how better the modding system can be.

#30

The sad thing is how much of this was driven by people shitting on Valve and Bethesda about how evil they are for doing this. When it does really seem like a naive attempt to add a monetization strategy for mod makers.

Am I wrong in saying that the uproar was mostly about charging for mods at all? Everything else about this, from the censorship to <insert conspiracy theory here> just seems insane considering Valve just turned a 180. If they were as bad as people made them out to be, they would have kept up with it.

I don’t relate to the vocal minority that seems to shout the loudest about things in the game industry anymore. There is so much vitriol that it makes me sad. Reasoned, well thought out arguments don’t fly, it is who can round up a lynch mob and yell the loudest. :disappointed:

#31

Reddit, lads

#32

The wrath of angry manchildren strikes video games yet again.

Okay, I don’t really mind it this time, truth be told.

#33

Did people flip the fuck out? Absolutely.
Was it justified? A little bit, yeah.

I think Valve went into this with the best intentions, honestly. They saw the kind of incentive that this model had on things like Dota cosmetics, and they thought they could just apply the same idea and get the same result. Firstly, I think they missed the point that game mods like these fundamentally need to be free in order to function. It’s the only way they can survive and thrive. Secondly, they didn’t understand the kind of support that would be required on their end. I know they thought it would be a great idea to leave it all in our hands, just put up the storefront and let the community police the content. But what about legal issues? What about stealing other peoples work? Intentionally or unintentionally? What about tools that all mods require like SKSE? Offering them bad legal advice and then telling them to “Lawyer up” is not ok.

Bottom line it was a genuine effort by Valve to try and improve a part of their community, that in the end turned out to be a half baked idea with insufficient implementation. Also, I’d like to note that Bethesda taking 45% of mod sales is un-fucking-acceptable. I don’t understand how they thought they could institute this policy, where people are making mods to supplement content they didn’t have in their game, or to fix content that was insufficient, or repair what was poorly designed, and they were going to rake in almost twice the amount of money that the people who did the work are getting? Bad form, Bethesda.

#34

#35

The whole “Master Race” thing is getting kind of old. Wish people would let that go.

#36

kind of old? that shit is like 70

in dog years